[alicyat824]

I live my life alongside a CG, he is my best friend and the love of my life. He is doing his best to do right and get on a good path. We have currently gone as far as to make sure he has no access to his money at all, it is all in my name and I give him an allowance daily and pay the bills as needed. I was doing a lot of research on gamblers who opt in to be self-banned from casinos. I live in Rhode Island, USA and we really only have one casino he goes to, there is only one other in the state and it’s about an hour from where we live. I feel as though if he were self-banned it would decrease my stress of leaving him alone and would greatly deter him from going because he wouldn’t risk getting arrested for being on casino premises. The only thing I’m afraid of is his bitterness over my control of the finances. He tries his best not to get vindictive over my financial decisions but it inevitably happens sometimes because he feels he is completely out of control of his life. If he were to self-ban I still wouldn’t want him to have access to his finances because of fear he would go to greater lengths to gamble.

To me however I fear he may also feel less in control with a self-ban because he will know for sure he has really been cut off from something he feels compelled to do. And due to that lack of control I think he may only agree to it if he is allowed access to his finances. He will feel as though he can have one or the other.

I’m looking for direction on how to approach this matter and potentially try to make him see what’s best for him.

thanks

ali

[monique]

<

Hello

Thanks for starting a thread in the Gambling Therapy friends and family forum. This forum will provide you with warmth and understanding from your peers.

Feel free to use the friends and family group, you’ll find the times for these if you click on the “Group times” box on our Home page. Now that you have introduced yourself you’ll find that many of the people you meet here have already read your initial introduction and they’ll welcome you in like an old friend 🙂

If you’re the friend or family member of someone who is either in, or has been through, the GMA residential programme please take extra care to make sure that nothing you say in groups, or on our forums, inadvertently identifies that person. Even if your loved one isn’t connected with GMA, please don’t identify them either directly or indirectly just in case they decide to use the site themselves.

You’ll find a lot of advice on this site, some of which you’ll follow, some you won’t…but that’s ok because only you fully understand your
situation and what’s best for you and the people you love. So, take the support you need and leave the advice you don’t because it all comes from a caring, nurturing place 🙂

We look forward to hearing all about you!

Take care

The Gambling Therapy Team

PS: Let me just remind you to take a look at our

privacy policy and terms and conditions so you know how it all works!

[monique]

It was good to see you in group and I hope you found the conversation useful. And I hope you will find answers to some of your questions here too.
I see in your post an anxiety to get things right for your partner’s sake. It is great that he has your support. I also have a concern that you might be forgetting to think about what the gambling has done to you and what support you need in your own ‘recovery’. Sometimes, it is when we recognize that we can never get it all just right for someone else and instead concentrate on the things within our own control, that we can feel a sense of release. I can’t promise what will then happen to the cg you love, but you can feel better and more in charge of your life. I hope this makes sense.
Most of all, it is good that you have been able to join us on this site and I wish you well.

Monique

[p]

Hello Ali it was nice to meet you in chat and i have to say i am guilty of never venturing over to the friends and family section even though i have family members who gamble myself and i find it hard to deal with but i am a cg myself.. so i guess i have just stuck to the cg section but its always lovely to see someone from f&f in the community group like a few hours ago. Nice to meet you and well done on coming here

P

[sam.sam]

Hi ali,
It was nice to see you in the group today. I am sure by attending the chat room today, you would have a better understanding of your position in relation to the person you are supporting.
I am a CG myself and in recovery and have used this site to challenge the problem I was and am facing. I just want to say you are in good hands.
All the best in your journey. Sam

[Anonimas]

I have been living with this for over eight months now, knowing about the compulsive gambling; the gambling had been going on much longer than that. My CG has not gambled in 105 days, but we still are having challenges. Even after all this time and all the ups and downs it so hard to tell someone how to approach this situation. I’ve said it’s like potty training it’s not going to click until they are ready!! At least your CG has admitted he has a problem. My husband’s vice was the gaming cafes or internet cafes…video gaming machines. I wished we had the same option as you have at the casino’s to self ban.

I would have a very honest conversation and ask him to ban himself from the casino. I would under no circumstances give him access to the finances again. It’s a huge accomplishment that he turned over everything to you to begin with. I also feared he would eventually resent turning over the finances. That really never happened but I can tell that he would like to have some control back and I have only noticed that recently.

I know I am not really giving you an answer but in my opinion the most important thing is you are protecting your finances. By the time I realized what was going on and I got a handle on money our credit and finances were shredded and are only now getting back on track.

It is a very long road to travel. How are you doing? Have you found a gamanon group for yourself. I have found that to be a huge support for me, people who understand your feelings and the crazy life you are leading.

[velvet]

Hi Ali
I am glad you have found your way to this site. I’m sorry that the F&F only group only has a 15 minute window at the beginning of the hour and then it is inaccessible. It would be great to meet you.
I wouldn’t be on this site if I didn’t know that the addiction to gamble can be controlled and I think you have made some good moves towards helping your CG. You cannot make him stop gambling but looking after the finances is always a good first step – it protects you and also your loved one. In my opinion though you cannot be his keeper and his conscience – you cannot save him – there is no approach that will potentially ‘make’ him see what is best for him – as a CG he will believe he knows what is best for him.
Unfortunately when the addiction is triggered the demands for finance can be quite frightening and it is easy to give in. Understanding the addiction will give you power over it – it is important to always remember that you do not have the addiction and therefore you are the stronger.
Keep posting Ali – there is a wealth of information on here for you. Hopefully I will meet you in a group soon. Nothing said in an F&F only group appears on the forum.
I am away for the weekend but I will look for you on my return.
Velvet

[alicyat824]

Thank you all for your thoughtful replies, I appreciate any and all feedback I have gained from this website.

To BB, I have read quite a few of your posts and I have to say that i’m almost mad at myself that I don’t know the exact date my CG last gambled, I’d like to have a running number of days like you. I think he would be proud of that. I actually attended my first Gam-Anon meeting last night, unfortunately where I live i had to take an 85 mile trip to accomplish that feat but I was determined and the others at the meeting commended me on my perseverance towards self-preservation. It was well worth the long hours.

Velvet, I’ve have seen your replies to many posts and I really admire your insight. I appreciate the way you speak to people and I’m glad to have your response on my post. I have tried my best to make myself available for F&F chat times but I have a busy schedule and it’s not always easy.

thanks again
Ali

[jenny46]

My ex partner is a CG. There was a recent interesting topic on the forum somewhere about self banning.

Your partner possibly may feel that he will have less control if he self bans – but less control of what ? It sounds more like he wants to keep the option to gamble there and alive rather than give a commitment to a gambling free life.

It also seems to suggest that he has not yet recognised the fact that if he gambles then he is and always will be out of control, if anything self banning places him in a better position to be in control.

If he wants to gamble then he will as you rightly say find a way but a self ban cuts some of the options and gives him time for a re think.

Ali it is great that you have control of the finances and although again he may feel that he lacks control, again he is not in the position as yet to be responsible for controlling finances which when the wrong decisions are made cause damage not only to himself but to others around him.

Personally I would rather listen to the protests than be sitting here facing yet another financial catastrophe and all that goes with it, as tedious as I know it can be.

To me Ali someone who becomes serious about recovery wants to put all the barriers in place as difficult as it may be. I don’t think it would be a very wise move to give in to any increased demands for money or to allow any bargains to be struck between choices of more money or self banning it just totally sounds like he wants to keep the avenues open.

Your own boundaries and barriers are just as important, trust in yourself as to what is best for you and just do your best to stick to your decisions because for you they will be the right ones.

Jenny

[alicyat824]

I’m actually not quite sure my CG knows that self-banning is an option that exists.

[velvet]

Hi Ali
In your first email you mention self-banning so I suspect Jenny felt that the idea was being pushed around by your partner.

Giving information to an active CG as to where he/she can find the support they need is something that F&F can actively get involved with. Perhaps you could look into the self-banning facility at the casino and write the information for him on a piece of paper so that he can look at it in his own time. I don’t suggest you tell him directly as his addiction will probably see you as threatening it and another row could ensue. He, of course is the only one who can actually do the self-banning which is part of him taking responsibility for his own life.

I also believe in printing off the ‘gamblers anonymous 20 questions’ (Google – gamblers anonymous 20 questions) and leaving them for the CG to find – he might screw it up and throw it away but many CGs are not aware that the problem they have is recognised and the 20 questions can be a seed sown in a confused mind. Whatever his reaction to your suggestions, in my opinion, it is best not to over-react. The light bulb moments for CGs are seldom, if ever, when the loved one F&F is suggesting ways forward because the addiction uses such conversations as a way into argument which can be turned into an excuse to gamble.

Keep posting. I hope to ‘meet’ you in a group soon

Velvet

[alicyat824]

Very frustrated today, my CG has been doing so well under pressure, I have been thoroughly enjoying my gam anon meetings and today while away on vacation my spouse asked me to go to the casino with him. It is an utterly defeating moment to be asked such a thing when you have been making such strides, a small insignificant moment in his eyes but a world of hurt in mine. I am almost ashamed I thought he was doing so well and yet again I have to be grateful he asked my opinion instead of running out of our hotel room at the wee hours to go by himself.

[velvet]

Hi Ali
Recovery, especially in the early stages can be very frustrating for the person closest to the CG.
I’m not sure about being grateful that he asked your opinion but I do see where you are coming from and at least you know the addiction is still in his head and activating his brain. I also take it that he did not go and gamble and that is a good thing. If his addiction was triggered and he resisted then you must have reacted well
What made you feel he was doing ok? Had his overall behaviour improved?
Unfortunately a CG can gamble in other ways apart from going to the casino – they can play with people all the time just not machines or cards. Compulsive gamblers may stop wagering for money but may continue to make ‘mind bets’. Some newly abstinent gamblers say that what they are keeping track of is the amount of money they have saved by not gambling while their addictive minds are still in action. If this is the case the CG can get excited by the prospect of an actual gamble which they are unable to shake off and it is possible that this is what happened.
Abstinence is not a recovery which is why I am asking about his general behaviour.
Don’t feel defeated, you are doing well. Keep enjoying your Gamanon, I know I did and it made all the difference. Hopefully you well keep posting here and the knowledge you gain will help you cope.
Velvet

[alicyat824]

Velvet, I felt as though he was doing good because he had been very cooperative with our money situation, we’ve gone through the cycle of him having and then not having access to his money on multiple occasions as I’m sure many partners and CG’s go through. Generally when we hit the „no access” stages he is cooperative but generally grows more bitter and reluctant/ resistant and tries to „handle” the situation himself and ultimately has a lapse in judgement leading to poor decision making. This „cycle” however I have seen minimal resistance and he has been more cooperative with the process. We have some rough moments but have overcome much of our communication issues on the subject of money, spending and the desire to gamble so this was my feeling that things were going good. They were better than past attempts and that was the good in it.

I’m not quite sure that grateful was the correct word to use but it was definitely like you said about bing happy to know what is going on in his head. I do feel as though I reacted in a positive way by simply saying no that I didn’t want to go to the casino and that I also thought it was a bad idea for him to. He simply said okay and that was the end of that.

I’m not quite sure I fully understand your concept of „mind bets” I get the explanation you provided at first but lose the analogy towards the end of your paragraph on it.

My next concern whilst we were on vacation was when I tried to bring up the concept of the casino self-ban that originally brought me to this community in the first place. I only asked if he knew what it was to which he replied yes and then I asked if he would be interested in doing it again he replied to say „if it was necessary”. I was a little thrown I have to admit because although I do recognize the disconnect that exists in an addicted persons mind between a problem and a debilitating process it still never ceases to amaze me how one who has literally rebuilt from absolutely nothing more than 10 times in the past year can still not see such a helpful step as „necessary”.

I’m slightly ashamed at myself for thinking so harshly of him but am at least proud to say I don’t express everything that I feel with regard to such.

Ali

[velvet]

Hi Ali
I am sorry that I have not replied to you before – I am afraid you slipped under my radar and I hope you are still reading.
Do not be ashamed of yourself for your thoughts. ‘If it was necessary’ (to self ban) sounds like a line his addiction was hoping would throw you off course and in that respect it succeeded. The addiction will have many, many confusing ripostes designed to flummox you because it is the master of threats and manipulation. The addiction to gamble is constantly seeking to gain time to get itself back into the driving seat if it thinks it is being threatened – and talk of self-banning is a threat to a CG who is not really ready to stop.
I hope I am homing in on the part of my post that you didn’t fully understand.
‘Some newly abstinent gamblers say that what they are keeping track of is the amount of money they have saved by not gambling while their addictive minds are still in action. If this is the case the CG can get excited by the prospect of an actual gamble which they are unable to shake off and it is possible that this is what happened.’
The addiction to gamble is not about money. As non-CGs it is the gambling for money that we tend to see as the signal that the addiction is live and so if the CG stops gambling with actual money, the non-CG may feel they are in a recovery. When a CG gambles their minds are fully activated by addiction but it is possible for a CG to stop gambling with actual money and to make all the right noises but to have the addiction alive in their minds. Abstinence is not enough.
It seems to me that your CG may want to control his addiction, he may have tried to abstain but he possibly does not have the determination and courage at this present time to let go completely – he seems to be keeping a door open ‘just in case’ and self-banning could close that door. If this is the case then an actual gamble is never very far away from him.
‘Abstinence is not a recovery which is why I am asking about his general behaviour.’

In case it was this line that you had a problem with. Once again it is important to recognize that the addiction to gamble is not about money – money is the tool, not the goal. CGs drastically change reality to fit their personal perception and it is this that is so destructive leading to lies and manipulation, breakdowns in relationships, loss of self-esteem and confidence. A CG in recovery behaves differently to a CG who is active so I was asking if your CG was behaving differently and if so what the difference was.
I have brought up my thread entitled ‘The F&F cycle’ in case you have not seen it – it may help.
I am glad you knew you could question something you did not understand and I hope I have answered you adequately. You are of course welcome in any F&F group – times in ‘Support Groups’ at the top of this page where your questions can be answered in real time.
Velvet

[alicyat824]

Been so long since I posted, I miss the community but I have found so much comfort in my Gam-Anon family I haven’t been compelled to post unfortunately. I need to work to give back to the community here also!

I’ve been feeling very frustrated with my CG and myself as of late.  I’m frustrated in general because of our lack of communication over his struggles with his gambling problem for one. He is not big on communicating his issues to me and I find that just being there to listen when he is having some sort of mental battle is my best role. I am not enabling nor trying to change but simply lending an ear to listen and it worked well for both of us (I think) for a while. But not so much anymore, we don’t talk about much lately. And besides him not being forthcoming, I am also not very good at asking either. I can definitely feel and see when he has some sort of struggle but in my desire not to be a nagging partner I often keep my mouth shut when I shouldn’t. This starts a vicious cycle that includes the lack of communication. His internalization. And my everlasting curiosity on his struggle.  I have backed off in my desire to change for sure but I have not given up my desire for knowledge. I’m certain it is still a way I feel in control of the situation by knowing exactly what is going on in his life.

During this cycle, when he doesn’t talk to me, I go to find out the information on my own anyways. By snooping in a serious way. I want to know EVERYTHING and I certainly find it out but then I inevitably put myself between a rock and a hard place because I’ve got the information but the only way I could bring it up for conversation is by selling myself out. I don’t want to let him know how inappropriately I delve into his private time and finances but because he has not told me what he has been up to I have no other way to bring it up.

Through this cycle I struggle to find ways to communicate more effectively so I do not have to snoop and I also struggle with my desire to know everything.  

[jenny46]

you have learned to communicate ? who’s talking back then ? not him clearly. snooping is not communicating is it ?
The biggest part of communication is listening. You are trying to read something that can never be understood, you think you know but you cannot ever know, you are not supposed to know – you will never know

Listen to yourself, and if you like to learn as you say you do then listen to yourself and know what you are telling you.

the biggest learning curve will be from how well you can listen to you and what you can learn from you

No matter how much you think you know or could learn you will never be in control of him or his addiction. you can only ever be in control of yourself

Jenny

[velvet]

Hi Ali
Playing the detective is incredibly wearing and frustrating and I think most of us who have experienced this method of trying to understand, or discover, have been very glad to stop doing it, as it is not part of who we are – but more a part of what the addiction has turned us into.
What information has put you between a rock and a hard place? Is this a discovery that he has been gambling or is it knowledge of the addiction that you think he does not possess?
What is your friend doing about his addiction? Is he attending GA, seeking counselling or what? It is not enough for you to lend an ear, he has to want to stop gambling enough to turn words into action.
A healthy desire to know about the addiction to gamble is not the same as delving into a friend’s private time and finances and I am concerned that such behaviour will boomerang back painfully. It is my belief that it is important to be completely honest with a CG because returning ‘like for like’ is, I think, counter-productive. When my CG started his gamble-free life the strangest thing for me was to realise that he had to learn to trust me – I had assumed the greatest lack of trust would be mine but it was not so. A CG’s world is full of mistrust, it emanates from them and it surrounds them. To take the leap of faith that is required to live a gamble-free life it is, my opinion, beneficial for the CG to know that that those around them are honest, or how else can they learn?
I hope some of this helps.
Speak soon.
Velvet

[alicyat824]

Jenny,
I certainly have plenty more to learn in the communication department so no I am not communicating the way I should (I think thats what you are asking) and I am wholeheartedly listening when he talks to me but this is a rare thing, I don’t have to work very hard at it because it isn’t happening regularly. I am listening to myself and hearing it but it is hard for me to implement.

Velvet,
The information that put me between a rock and a hard place requires a bit of back story so I’m sorry if this is long and drawn out. I have long since known about the gambling issue itself and have not „officially”found anything that leads me to believe he has relapsed. When he originally came clean to me about his financial troubles related to gambling I was put in charge of the finances (we are not legally married but we may as well be for this purpose) in an effort to put me in charge I was given a list of all login info for any sort of financial accounts online such as the bank account, credit card accounts etc. In this process I was NOT given the login info for one particular account used for credit purposes (it lists accounts, debt and an estimated credit score). But I am able to log in to this website because all of his usernames and passwords are about the same so I figured it out.

So, one day I tried to log in to one of his Credit card accounts and was locked out, i asked him why and he said he had to reset the password, ok, I gave him the benefit of the doubt and gave him a day or two to resolve it. He kept saying he had to call, now this was about a month or so ago. In the mean time by logging into the credit reporting site I discovered he had not only applied for a new credit card, gotten approved for it, and maxed it out. None of which he told me. This new card is with the same old company he already has one with. Now if I had been able to log in to this company I would have seen it right away which is why I think he has failed to rectify the login issue with the account. I also found the new card in his wallet. Now because he technically did not give me the login info for the credit reporting site I never would have found this info had I not been snooping. I’ve tried to get him to simply tell me about the card by bringing the website login up multiple times to no avail.

As for your other questions, he had been attending GA with me for awhile but has not attended in a couple of weeks. I support him and „remind” him of which meetings are in session on any given night but he’s always „too tired” or „not feeling well” So I go alone and enjoy my reprieve but wish he would make more of an effort in his own recovery.

thanks girls
Ali

[velvet]

Hi Ali
I am sorry you couldn’t drop in on my group just after you wrote this post – it would be good to communicate in real time. It is now too late in the evening for me to give your post the considered reply it deserves but I do thank you for explaining the rock and the hard place to which I can now fully relate.
I will reply as soon as possible.
Velvet

[velvet]

Hi Ali
I can see your rock and hard place now – thank you.
Your friend asked you to help him by handling his finances so when he retook control he would have known that you were going to be locked out of the accounts. However, having asked for your support with his finances and knowing that you are aware of his addiction, it seems to me, he knows there is a bombshell waiting to happen – so probably all the time you are hoping he is going to communicate, his addiction is playing for time – chasing his losses, thus leaving him with nothing he is prepared to say.
It is an unfortunate by-product of digging that nasty things surface and having brought them up it seems impossible to bring them into the open. I am not opting out when I say I cannot tell you what to do because in my opinion it depends on what you are prepared for, rather than what you want. His addiction is highly manipulative and it will not like being caught out. Many people have found that if they treat the addiction like an angry beast in the corner of the room, waiting to strike when threatened, they can open communication more easily. Keeping that addiction beast at bay is not easy but once it is between you it is very frightening – everything you say is distorted by it and everything you hear is twisted by it.
My CG told me that as soon as I started to speak to him his addiction would be on full alert so when I told him that I loved him and wanted to support him, his addiction said to him that I was obviously lying because he was a worthless, unlovable failure and I only wanted to undermine him. As a result he fought back with lies and threats because he didn’t have any other coping mechanism, leaving me to retire wounded and confused.
Standing back and listening, as you are doing, makes it easier not to get caught up in an unwanted argument because the addiction has nothing to get its teeth into but of course this does give the addiction freedom to believe it is safe.
This all sounds a little negative but the positive side is that when you remove yourself from the centre of the addiction, you have time and energy to look after you.
Without any judgement Ali, it seems you have been affected too much by the addiction of another and your happiness should not be dependent on the outcome of this dilemma. You have written that you are going alone and enjoying your reprieve but does this mean you feel released?
Speak soon
Velvet

[jenny46]

My comments on communication are by no means a criticism of you. I unfortunately know only to well the desire to communicate with an active CG, to talk, to sort things out and hopefully to start again with a ‘clean slate’

I am particularly familiar with the desire to snoop and like you my snooping skills served me well and I found out all sorts of things that I didn’t want to know, the results of which pointed to one thing, which was the addiction was still there kicking and screaming, finding new ways of funding itself, more lies and deceipt and consequently more distrust.

Managing someones finances is a short term fix, it is a barrier to assist someone in their quest to control their addiction. Someone who really wants to stop, not someone who has made sure that they have left themselves an avenue to continue their habit. There will always be another avenue until he wants to stop. Your snooping will drive it even more under ground than it is already, you unfortunately will burn out trying to keep ahead of the situation, its not worth the hassle.

I can only tell you what I would do and that is to make sure my own financial situation was safe and protected and then let him get on with it, his addiction, his debt, his consequences. No snooping, just concentrating on thoughts of how I could best look after me. No more listening to the lies etc. It took me a long time to get to that and the burnout in between was awful, through the snooping, trying to communicate and pure bewilderment as to why everything was happening and what I could do.

It took me a long time to accept properly that there was nothing I could do and no real way to understand all the ins and outs of it all.

What I meant was not that there is anything wrong with how you are communicating with him, but how you are communicating with yourself. In your posts, your happiness seems to depend on his outcomes and not yours, you listen well to him and you have learned what you can.

I think from my knowledge of my own experience and reading between the lines of very many struggles on this forum, I would say that the toughest lesson I’ve learned and the best one ever was to begin to look after me, to trust and listen to myself instead of wasting countless hours listening to the blithering promises and lies of an addiction, through that listening I learned to look after me and put myself further up the list of priorities than I had been doing, the rest slowly fell in to place.

I hope that clears up my somewhat cryptic last post to you

Jenny

[alicyat824]

Velvet, I very much can understand your insight especially more now that I went to my Gam-Anon meeting last night and my „family” there told me essentially the same thing as you when you say I have allowed my CG’s gambling to affect me too much as I very much have. They offered me the ideas that many of my plans and ideas on how to better the situation while in my head are good decisions for me I still am basing a lot of my decisions on him and his gambling also. I am helping myself without fully „letting go and letting god” and that is my biggest and deepest underlying struggle.

Jenny, my happiness does very often seem to depend on him these days, no matter the amount I supposedly concentrate on me I have yet to find what exactly works for me to actually seperate my happiness from his. I have indeed taken the necessary steps to secure my own finances, and do not feel that I am at any risk financial unless I were to enable him willingly I dont think he could access any of my money

Ali

[velvet]

Hi Ali
When one person tells you something you can choose easily to ignore it, when two tell you the same thing it is maybe time to listen but when you are being given the same message by many, in my opinion, it would be unwise not to take note and action on what you hear, I believe that is what makes this site so great. I am so pleased you have a strong Gamanon family – I am sure you will be a tremendous support to others in your group.
A positive post, well done
V

[velvet]

Hi Ali
I can see that you are giving support to others which is terrific but please don’t forget to ask for support for yourself.
How are things with you? Have you found out what works for you?
Speak soon
Velvet

[Autorius]

Įrašai